Murtonen suku

[petergmdale]

Greetings,

I have had absolutely no success in identifying the parentage (or any other information whatsoever) of my GG-Grandmother Maria Murtonen. The information that I have is as follows:

Maria Murtonen was baptized May 10, 1829 and died June 18, 1867. Her husband was David (Taavetti) Tiirikainen who was a Farmer. He was born in 1818 in Niemisjärvi #8 Laitila, Kuopio mlk, he married Maria on February 2, 1851 and he died on June 10, 1876 [or May 18, 1876]. I found an unsourced reference to Maria Murtonen’s father being named Anders.

David and Maria had 7 children:

1. Pahl – 3.1.1853
2. Matts – 20.2.1855
3. David - 6.6.1858 (my G-Grandfather)
4. Maria - 6.6.1860
5. Eva Stina - 26.10.1862
6. Jacob - 26.9.1865
7. Gretha - 7.5.1867

Any assistance in learning the parentage or anything at all about Maria would be much appreciated. Kiitos.

Cheers,

Pete

[Tuula Cu]

Hello Pete,

In the Announced to be married = Kuulutetut for 1851 (SSHY) you can find out that Maria Andersfotter Murtonen was from Lamberila No. 3:

http://www.sukuhistoria.fi/sshy/kirjat/Kirkonkirjat/kuopio/kuulutetut_1821-1860_msrk_tk1654-1655/239.htm

and in Lamberila 3 (part II) in Communion book 1844-53 you find here
http://www.sukuhistoria.fi/sshy/kirjat/Kirkonkirjat/kuopio/rippikirja_1844-1853_msrk_tk1633-1634/408.htm
in Lamberila Luti that there is an Anders Andersson Murtonen, Lb=landbonde, lower down Johannes Murtonen, bror=brother and finally syster=sister Maria Murtonen. It says that they all have come in 1849 from Maaninga=nowadays Maaninka parish.

Even lower down I think you may have the mother of those three, Anders Murtoses Enka Mor (mother) Ingeborg Holopainen, and two other children, Anna Lisa and Ingeborg.

At a quick glance to Maaninka Baptized you find at least Ingeborg born in 1831 to those parents (only it is Mustonen here, not Murtonen! Mustonen is a common name in eastern Finland, Murtonen is not at all common) - and the village or farm name Vänäensaari.

Now you will have to go through Venäensaari people, beginning from here:
http://www.sukuhistoria.fi/sshy/kirjat/Kirkonkirjat/maaninka/rippikirja_1832-1842_tk1203/426.htm and hopefully you find a new clue also with this clue from the Marriages of Kuopio msk where Anders is written as Mustoin, which is the same as Mustonen:

6.6.1819 Hirvilax Drg. Anders Mustoin Pig. Ingeborg Holopain Hirvilax

Regards from Tuula K

[petergmdale]

Hi Tuula,

Many thanks for the information. I would not have ever otherwise discovered it! Am I correct in assuming that the description “Drg.” for Anders refers to a military position, i.e. dragoon? I have found Maria and her siblings on the HisKi Project website. The name is spelled Mustonen, Mustoin, Murdonen and Murdoin. I have not yet identified Anders or Ingeborg’s parents but will keep looking! I see that Ingeborg was 6 months pregnant when she married Anders so it looks like it was a “shotgun” wedding!

Cheers,

Pete

[Tuula Cu]

Hello Pete,

Drg is short for dräng, which means farmhand. Dragon is shortened by "drag".

Here you can find useful word lists (abbreviations, professions/occupation and causes of death) in three languages:
http://www.saunalahti.fi/hirvela/indexuk.html .

Good luck further! I am sure you can find the parents in the church books in the net. SSHY has a lot of Kuopion msk and so has digi.narc.fi - once they get over the problems they have just now in their images.

Tuula

[petergmdale]

Greetings,

I have made some progress with my Murtonen family research. As referenced above, my GGG-Grandmother was Ingeborg Holopainen. I have discovered that she was born illegitimate and was the daughter of Anna Liisa Holopainen. I attach hereto information that I have discovered to date.

I would be very interested in any hypotheses, suggestions or conjecture as to why Anna Liisa would have had 3 children illegitimately and without identifying the father. There is family lore that this side of the family was part Gypsy? Is this a possibility? Was she simply of “ill repute” or otherwise antisocial? I look forward to any assistance and Happy Thanksgiving from Canada!

Cheers,

Pete

[Toivain]

Hi. It seems Anna Liisa had some one, probably married man, in her neighbourhood. Have you tried to find godfather for the children? That is allways speculation, but can give us a hint. You can also try to find the master of the house, she was registered in.

It just not first occured to me call her antisocial. She was perhaps a hard working woman, pretty, and men or just one married man find her attractive.
It looks like a love story, because the children were born in short time, one pregnancy after other.

[Tuula Cu]

Yes, it is difficult say how the mothers of illegitimate children were: were they anti-social or over-social. But they were poor, probably had no choice of husbands. The father usually was not so far away - but for a genealogist they are hard to find. Sometimes the pastor of the parish has been strict and there is a remark also on the supposed father's church book line, sometimes not. Often the father got fines to pay, the mother the remark of a Qp=qvinnsperson for life + remarks on absolvation. The children often bore the remark of oä=oäkta until married.

As to gipsies, they were at the time you are researching still moving from one place to another, so Anna Liisa Holopainen does not seem to be a gipsy. Gipsies also have Swedish-sounding names in Finland, and Holopainen is a quite traditional Finnish surname in the east. But it is, of course, possible that the father of one/some of the children was a gipsy.
In church books and in Hiski you can see "Zig" or something like that for "zigenare" in front of gipsies.

But here some help (or more to ponder) for you,
Lastenkirja 1805-13 (children's book) page from SSHY,
http://www.sukuhistoria.fi/sshy/kirjat/Kirkonkirjat/kuopio/lastenkirja_1805-1813_msrk_tk1641/102.htm
- right there is also "Henric Holopain" and the text "son, fr. P. 186 till 387"
and "Adam Lippoin(?), xxx i fotstock i 813 (?) ifr Maninga ..812."
>is Henric thus an earlier son and if he is, how old in those pages?
>what has Adam Lippoin here to do?
>fotstock means that Adam has been sitting like this
http://www.cartinafinland.fi/fi/picture/17077/Jalkapuut.html as a punishment.

You could go on by finding at SSHY
http://www.sukuhistoria.fi/sshy/index_eng.htm the earlier Hirvlax children's books and communion books (Rippikirja), those pages.
I do not know if you have used SSHY or the other, Diginarc, http://digi.narc.fi/digi/?lang=en_US before, both have original books to see. SSHY has lists of villages so you might begin with it and learn where the Hirvlax images are, approximately.

Diginarc has had problems these weeks but their images can be saved and thus seen better. In Diginarc put the parish name's beginning only in the Search if you do not seem to get any results - the parishes are in genitive form and the parish name sometimes changes a little at the end... here you have both Kuopion maaseurakunta (parish around Kuopio town) and Kuopion kaupunki (town) and their Born and baptized, Syntyneet ja kastetut for that time: http://digi.narc.fi/digi/hae_ay.ka?ay=2596530.KA

Tuula K

[petergmdale]

Many thanks Tuulia and Tuula for your replies. I am working my way through the information which is proving to be very helpful. As an FYI, I attach my progress to date on the Murtonen family. Kiitos!

Cheers,

Pete

[petergmdale]

One more thing that I forgot to add is that I found Henrik Holopainen’s death entry on HisKi (see p. 6) of the attached. He was a Crofter and lived in Hirvilax 12. He was unmarried and died in 1834 at the age of 42. Thus he was born in approximately 1792-93. I suspect that, perhaps, this is the reason that Anna Liisa left her home in Maaninka. Just speculation of course! I have yet to identify any additional information on Adam Lippoin except that he was married in 1817 and was a Crofter in Hirvilax.

Cheers,

Pete

[petergmdale]

Greetings,

I have been working my way through the Murtonen side of the family. I believe that I have correctly established the parentage of Anders Murtonen/Mustonen (husband of Ingeborg Holopainen and father of Maria Murtonen b. 1829). It appears that he was born in 1780 in Kasurila, Kuopio and was the son of Anders Mustoin (b. approximately 1756) and Valborg Jäskeläin (born October 22, 1755 in Hamula, Kuopio).

Both Anders Sr. and Valborg died on the same day (May 14, 1782) leaving 3 young children orphaned. Anders Jr. would have been only 2 years old. I have found that Valborg’s parents both predeceased Anders Sr. and Valborg. I have not yet been able to identify Anders Sr.’s parentage so I do not know if they were still alive.

I am curious what happened to orphaned children in such circumstances during that period of Finnish history. This was already a modest family at best prior to the parent’s death. I have found that one of Anders sister eventually married a Crofter with whom she had previously had a child and is later found in the death records in poverty or “Rotfattig”. Who was responsible for the orphaned children? Other relatives, the church...?

Lastly, except for unfortunate Anders Sr. and Valborg above, I am quite amazed at the longevity of certain of these individuals notwithstanding what would appear to be dire economic circumstances. Good genes I guess?

I have attached the latest draft of my Murtonen Family History. Any thoughts, tips or advice would be welcome. Especially, if I have misidentified Anders Jr.’s parents or if anyone can assist me in identifying Anders Sr.’s parents. Many thanks.

Cheers,

Pete

[Tuula Cu]

Hi,

As far as I have noticed, the orphans were often living with their relatives since the parents had died. They started early working as farm hands or servants in that or other farm. Not the best possible life I think.

There were two words for the poor who were taken care: rotfattig (rota poor) and kyrkfattig (church poor). A rotfattig (old people, handicapped or under-the-age children) were shifting annually from one farm to another in a rota. This system was handled by the commune, and later on developed into social care. Earlier the parish took care of the poor and they were called kyrkfattig, they got some support from the parish and could live in a hut of their own or with relatives. (Shifting from one house to another must have been quite dreadful.)

I have also been wondering at the high death age of my poor ancestors in Eastern Finland. I guess it is good genes then - and healthy food (fish, game, rye bread, berries)...

Tuula

[vainoh]

Hi,

Would this be the same Anders Mustoin?

Anders Mustoin b. 1743 is mentioned in Kasurila with wife Valborg Jäskeläin b. 1756
http://www.digiarkisto.org/sshy/kirjat/Kirkonkirjat/kuopio/rippikirja_1782-1788_msrk_tk1625-1626/180.htm
Valborg is dead in 1782, Anders marries Elis: Zacheus b. 1754
They move to Hackarala number 5
http://www.digiarkisto.org/sshy/kirjat/Kirkonkirjat/kuopio/rippikirja_1782-1788_msrk_tk1625-1626/37.htm
where Anders dies before 1796, widow Elisab: moves back to her home village Kehvo.

Children's book
http://www.digiarkisto.org/sshy/kirjat/Kirkonkirjat/kuopio/lastenkirja_1786-1804_msrk_tk1640-1641/269.htm
lists two children from first marriage:
Margareta b. 1778
Anders b. 1780, looks like he died in 1790 !
and one from the second:
Jöran b. 1787

VäinöH

[petergmdale]

Greetings,

Thank you Tuula & Väinö for your posts. It looks like I must have the wrong Anders Murtonen/Mustonen (b. 1780). All I know about the Anders (b. 1780) who was the husband of Ingeborg Holopainen and father of Maria Murtonen (b. 1829) is as follows:

Anders Murtonen/Mustonen/Mustoin/Murdonen/Murdoin

Anders was a Farm-Hand or Hired Man from Hirvilax at the time of his marriage. All of his children except for one were born in Venäjänsaari, Maaninka. He moved from Maaninka to Lamberila #3 with his family in 1849. He lived at Lamberila # 3 at the time of his daughter Maria’s marriage. According to the baptism entries of certain of Anders children he was a Tenant Farmer.

b. approx. 1780
m. June 6, 1819 – Kuopion msrk
d.

The marriage entry for Anders and Ingeborg in the HisKi Project genealogy website is as follows:

Kuopion msrk:

6.6.1819
Hirvilax
Drg. Anders Mustoin
Pig. Ingeborg Holopain
Hirvilax

Anders Murtoin b. 1780 can be found here (Communion Book 1813-1819)

http://www.digiarkisto.org/sshy/kirjat/Kirkonkirjat/kuopio/rippikirja_1813-1819_msrk_tk1627-1628_i/374.htm (http://www.digiarkisto.org/sshy/kirjat/Kirkonkirjat/kuopio/rippikirja_1813-1819_msrk_tk1627-1628_i/374.htm)

in the previous Communion Book 1805-1813 here

http://www.digiarkisto.org/sshy/kirjat/Kirkonkirjat/kuopio/rippikirja_1805-1813_msrk_tk1627_i/149.htm (http://www.digiarkisto.org/sshy/kirjat/Kirkonkirjat/kuopio/rippikirja_1805-1813_msrk_tk1627_i/149.htm)

where it says he came from Karttula parish in 1812 in Karttula here

http://www.digiarkisto.org/sshy/kirjat/Kirkonkirjat/karttula/rippikirja_1802-1812_tk2112/90.htm (http://www.digiarkisto.org/sshy/kirjat/Kirkonkirjat/karttula/rippikirja_1802-1812_tk2112/90.htm)

Anders left from Karttula on October 3, 1812 to move to Kuopion msrk. He arrived on October 31, 1812. This entry is found in the ‘Moved (in)’ category on the HisKi Project genealogy website as follows:

Kuopion msrk:

To From
Departure Arrival Village Farm Person Place

3.10.1812 31.10.1812 CB. 412 v. 3. Dräng Anders Bengtin Karttula

original - LISÄ: (Nattvardsgång = ledig), (Giftermål = ledig)
original - IKÄ: 1785
original - MANKÖN: Sivun käänteessä piilossa?
original - KVINNKÖN: Sivun käänteessä piilossa?
original - MUUTTONRO: 181
person: Dräng Anders Murtoin (1780) (CB. 138 v. 1 (Nattvardsgång = ledig), (Giftermål = ledig))
person: Piga Lovisa Hult (1794) (CB. 79 v. 1. (Nattvardsgång = ledig), (Giftermål = ledig))
person: Dräng Olof Nissinen (1786) (CB. 79 v. 1. (Nattvardsgång = led), (Giftermål = gift))
person: hans hust: Maria Eskelin (1783) (CB. 79 v. 1. (Nattvardsgång = led), (Giftermål = gift))
person: deras s:n Petter Nissin (16/2 1811) (BB. 84 (minderår.))

The entry above describes Anders as a Farmhand who was born in 1780. It would appear that Anders moved with a group of individuals, including other Farmhands, from Karttula to Kuopion msrk. I believe the entry states that he was unmarried. You will note that the entry above refers to Anders as “Murtoin” rather than “Mustoin”.

I have not been able to identify Anders’ parentage or anything else about him. Any assistance is much appreciated. Thank you!

Cheers,

Pete

[vainoh]

Seems to me the name Murtonen is very rare around Kuopio, that might explain why it may be confused with the more common Mustonen.

HisKi has people named Murtonen/Murdoin/Murtoin further south, in Mikkeli, Kangasniemi and Juva parishes. That could be where Anders came from before coming to Karttula.

VäinöH

[petergmdale]

Thank you Tuula and Väinö for your posts and information. I will see what else I can discover regarding Anders parentage. I was somewhat disheartened to see that HisKi does not have births/christenings for the year 1780 in either of Mikkeli or Kangasniemi! I’m feeling rather stumped. I will keep you posted if I make progress!

Cheers,

Pete

[petergmdale]

Greetings,

I’m still stumped on how to trace Anders Murtonen’s parentage given the lack of HisKi records. I would very much welcome some advice and/or assistance with respect thereto. Thank you.

Regards,

Pete

[petergmdale]

Greetings,

Just a brief note to see if anyone may have some advice/insight as to how I may further my Murtonen ancestry. I am still very stumped and am keen to try to establish the parentage of Anders Murtonen (for background please see the above post). Anders left from Karttula on October 3, 1812 to move to Kuopion msrk. He arrived on October 31, 1812. He married Ingeborg Holopainen on June 6, 1819 in Kuopion msrk.

Any assistance is most appreciated. Kiitos!

Cheers,

Pete